HIP HOP & THE MATURATION PROCESS

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Permalink Reply by Rowdee on November 22, 2008 at 12:30am

First, kudos for the dope topic, this is the kind of stuff that I had hoped Yadibox was gonna be about when we first got started.....now, to answer the question........Hip-Hop has always, from it's most rudimentary stages, been about being that much more clever than the next guy.....a fly ass way to brag on your own personal shine over a hot loop of something from the crates. Its origins from the streets gave it an edge and a cynicism that is absent from most pop music. As such, it has remained the same while the world around it changed......it became an artist's tool for self promotion instead of the other way around......cats used to use themselves to promote what the genre was all about......now, the music is the vessel, the biggest tool in an artist's arsenal in order to build a brand that can be packaged and sold to an otherwise ignorant audience.......we've been duped into believing that it's about the music, but upon further inspection, it's not......

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Permalink Reply by Buc and the Preecher on November 22, 2008 at 12:34pm

Thanx for the Kudos Row. Your right it has downgraded to a promotional tool and that is a tragedy. But the question still remains Why? Rock N Roll is used in the same fashion but that did not stop it from growing and maturing. If it was truly evloving then artists wouldn't be ridiculed for continuing they're careers.

Born

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Permalink Reply by D'Average Man on November 24, 2008 at 12:35pm

I think that the maturation in hip-hop stopped when the maturation process of black youth was derailed, and at the same time the marketers catering to the white mainstream found a way to use it and suck the life out of it until it's the bone-dry state that the game is in today. How many times do you hear how wack a song is, but you see and hear about every piss ass surburban white youngin and young adult with that wack ass song bangin in their bedrooms? The crossroads were layed down when Public Enemy reached its peak and scared the white adults, while NWA fascinated the little white kids. When it became apparent that the most controversial rap could be sold for millions, you saw PE's downfall( that Anti-Semite shit with Griff was icing on an otherwise inevitable cake) and the need for knowledge and responsibility in hip-hop fall off. White mainstream media took that controversy and made money off of shocking the suburbs. While they were shocked, the black communitites were living it, and there was no more signs of ending the deevolution of our communities. Sooner after that, Rodney King got his ass whupped and LA went into meltdown and the whole country felt it. I noticed that as the changes in the messages in music were happening, I saw more of my friends and whatnot, start hustling and getting guns and people started dying. The death and destruction and the fight for survival by selling dope killed EVERYthing.....That's my opinion, though.

.....And for a quick debate on the origin thang, Blues made Jazz, RnB, AND Rock N Roll....Blues is the most original form of American Music, and it made everything. Jazz is a form of Blues and classical, Rock n Roll is Blues for Whites.....LOL...true, though.

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Permalink Reply by Rowdee on November 24, 2008 at 11:06pm

I think HIp-Hop lost it's way for a lot of the same reasons the black community lost its way......mainly, it comes down to a lack of leadership at the top.....the artists that sell the most records are most loyal to the vehicles that get them the most money, namely songs and concepts that appeal across a broad spectrum, i.e. sex, drugs, guns, bling, etc. Outside of that, they don't concern themselves with leadership and being role models because that stuff don't move units. The most selfish elements of our collective psyche are being nourished today, and as a result, it's reflected in our music and culture. In short, we are a symbol of our times, like it or not.

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Permalink Reply by Buc and the Preecher on November 25, 2008 at 1:22am

D' Ave you make a strong point. I agree, the black youth did get hit with a blow during that time. Our communities were buzzing off of crack and the Regan era and though artist like Public Enemy and X Clan were speaking out it was a struggle. Then NWA lights the fuse to gangsta rap and all the drugies and negative people finally got what they've been wanting...a voice that told them what they were doing wasn't all that bad...that it was cool....they have been holding on for dear life since.
It's just a shame that Hip Hop was that voice because your right that's when Hip Hop lost its integrity.

Row I agree there is a lack of leadership at the top of Hip Hop. But I disagree with "leadership and role models can't sell units". They can sell....but that kind of artist is not being givin a fair shot in main stream radio. Come on do you really think we are the only ones that think little wayne is garbage? a lot of people do but the powers that be will continue to push him (for a bunch of reasons that will take to long to break down) and as long as they push him his music will sell. If they wanted to push Common or Mos Def like that they would do those numbers as well. They are killing two birds with one stone by pushing artist like little wayne on the kids and that's what's really going on

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Permalink Reply by Rowdee on November 25, 2008 at 10:53pm

When I spoke of leadership and role models not moving units, I should have been clearer in that I was speaking in the voice of one of these jackasses that run the lablels.....of course Common, Talib, Mos Def, etc. would do well if the had access to the type of promotion afforded to the Waynes and Soulja Boys.....but that ain't in the interest of these cats, they would rather take it to the lowest form and give light to the crap that basically sells itself....in other words, they would take the easy way out.....its not a matter of pushing the best product, but what is the easiest to promote......sex and drugs sell to anyone, across all demographics....and they would rather hype the young idiots instead of the old lions

Buc and the Preecher said:

D' Ave you make a strong point. I agree, the black youth did get hit with a blow during that time. Our communities were buzzing off of crack and the Regan era and though artist like Public Enemy and X Clan were speaking out it was a struggle. Then NWA lights the fuse to gangsta rap and all the drugies and negative people finally got what they've been wanting...a voice that told them what they were doing wasn't all that bad...that it was cool....they have been holding on for dear life since.
It's just a shame that Hip Hop was that voice because your right that's when Hip Hop lost its integrity.

Row I agree there is a lack of leadership at the top of Hip Hop. But I disagree with "leadership and role models can't sell units". They can sell....but that kind of artist is not being givin a fair shot in main stream radio. Come on do you really think we are the only ones that think little wayne is garbage? a lot of people do but the powers that be will continue to push him (for a bunch of reasons that will take to long to break down) and as long as they push him his music will sell. If they wanted to push Common or Mos Def like that they would do those numbers as well. They are killing two birds with one stone by pushing artist like little wayne on the kids and that's what's really going on

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Permalink Reply by DJ Pete Marriott on August 10, 2009 at 6:15am

Born,

First of all I don't know how I didn't catch this discussion until now but I think it's time for people in our age group to push for Clear Channel, Emmis Communications and Infinity to create ACHH (Adult Contemporary Hip Hop) Radio Stations. Let the kids continue with what they think hip hop is and let us push for a radio format that speaks to us. We're consumers too and if ,ore people get involved in a campaign to make these corporations listen to us they will have no choice but to listen to us for once. If we can put Obama in office we can do anything.

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Permalink Reply by Buc and the Preecher on August 10, 2009 at 11:35am

That's exactly the philosophy I'm putting out there. It's time for us to force Hip Hop music to mature because the generations that grew up on real Hip Hop will never except what today's Hip Hop music has to offer. When your use to quality its hard to go backwards. Like you said Pete we have to create a new market (contemporary Hip Hop Music) where artist and fans can create and support the kind of music they respect. Yet again bro we are on the same page.

Born

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Permalink Reply by Charles on January 7, 2010 at 1:17pm

Sorry to be coming on so late in this conversation but I do have another spin on it. Hip Hop is a living thing and progresses and regresses. I wouldn't say that wayne is garbage because if you listen to his albums he improves on his art each time. Don't get me wrong I'm not saying he's even close to the best. See we are becoming like our old folks when we say what the kids got out here is wack. I like souljah boy just like I liked "Do the Peewee Herman" and Rob Base. Some of us old cats even make songs about what these young dudes be doing instead of working on their art. I'm not feeling Mos Def's ecstatic but I gotta respect when he's just rhyming and not just going off. Talib has great lyrics but his flow never changes. Common's last album is all about sex (I like sex) so is he a sellout? We all are really working this art to touch the divine so I think our biggest problem is the lack of a wholistic approach to the music. We got to talk about bling, parties, pu55y, dances etc. but we also got to add education, spirituality, economics etc. The spirituals being the original form of Black Music in this country was all about that mixing the secular the sacred and the illicit altogether.

Cimo

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Permalink Reply by Buc and the Preecher on January 8, 2010 at 2:05pm

I hear you Charles and you make some interesting points. I agree with your statement "We got to talk about bling, parties, pu55y, dances etc. but we also got to add education, spirituality, economics etc". The problem is radio is not supporting artist with a wholistic approach.....if the did that would help Hip Hop music mature.

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Permalink Reply by Charles on January 8, 2010 at 2:26pm

What's really effed up is that every region don't have it's own sound! Radio execs is about making money so they could give a damn about what we listen to and whether it's uplifting or not. They just find the money making formula and go with it.

Buc and the Preecher said:

I hear you Charles and you make some interesting points. I agree with your statement "We got to talk about bling, parties, pu55y, dances etc. but we also got to add education, spirituality, economics etc". The problem is radio is not supporting artist with a wholistic approach.....if the did that would help Hip Hop music mature.

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Permalink Reply by Buc and the Preecher on January 8, 2010 at 2:48pm

Exactly.....the radio execs are in bed with the major labels and what they push only benefits them and a handful of artist willing to play the game. But the sad thing is it wasn't always like that with radio. Some where along the way things got bad.



Charles said:

What's really effed up is that every region don't have it's own sound! Radio execs is about making money so they could give a damn about what we listen to and whether it's uplifting or not. They just find the money making formula and go with it.

Buc and the Preecher said:

I hear you Charles and you make some interesting points. I agree with your statement "We got to talk about bling, parties, pu55y, dances etc. but we also got to add education, spirituality, economics etc". The problem is radio is not supporting artist with a wholistic approach.....if the did that would help Hip Hop music mature.

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